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Toto 6/49 - @statisticians/mathematicans/etc
Djinn
#1 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 1:41:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/13/2008
Posts: 1,565
Today's Business Daily carries a story about Toto 6/49 and the likelihood that it is going under:

http://www.businessdaily.../-/hulbrnz/-/index.html

I have always wondered, each time I am tempted to play that lottery, why, in the last eight years, no one has ever won the jackpot.

So, thinking of 8 years x 52 weeks x n thousands of Kenyans that fork out money every week to play the lottery, what are the chances that NO ONE has won the lottery. I guess the variables in themselevs are so many but that must also mean that chances that someone could win are also very likely?

Sorry I am not big in the maths department but happy if some numbers inclined person can share some thoughts.

I'd wager that they only pay out a fraction of what they collect, use another fraction for business overheads, etc - so how have they reached this point without ever having paid out the jackpot and without ever having paid out a serious amount to be shared by 2-3 individuals?
Renegade
#2 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 3:17:44 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/18/2009
Posts: 118
Strange indeed. However, they might just not have been generating enough business. The entry of the flashier SMS based lotteries e.g. 6969 or was it 6868 stole the thunder from them.
njugunajohn
#3 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 3:49:49 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/15/2011
Posts: 125
Location: Nairobi
I'm your numbers guy. You see in campus, for those who took mathematics as a course, there was a Basic mathematics unit and one of the topics dealt with was on permutations and combinations.
The difference between these two is that one deals with the probability of the occurrence of events with the events occurring in a certain order whereas the other one deals with the occurence of events occuring but with no particular order associated with the events.
For the Toto 6/49 game this translates as one being able to draw the numbers but with no emphasis on the order with which they were drawn.
Here we use what we are calling combinations since the order doesn't matter.
Note we also consider whether repetitions occur or not.
In our case numbers are not repeated.
To calculate the chance of winning we use the formula n!/r!(n-r)!
Using this formula we find that the chances of winning that lottery in any one draw is 1/13,983,816
The number sounds large but I think the first lotto guys were dishonest since some of the American lotteries have even greater odds and guys hit the jackpot almost all the time.
Of course their country has a higher population than ours but eight years is too long for no one to have won.
I think it is a scam.
Djinn
#4 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 3:59:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/13/2008
Posts: 1,565
njugunajohn wrote:
I'm your numbers guy. You see in campus, for those who took mathematics as a course, there was a Basic mathematics unit and one of the topics dealt with was on permutations and combinations.
The difference between these two is that one deals with the probability of the occurrence of events with the events occurring in a certain order whereas the other one deals with the occurence of events occuring but with no particular order associated with the events.
For the Toto 6/49 game this translates as one being able to draw the numbers but with no emphasis on the order with which they were drawn.
Here we use what we are calling combinations since the order doesn't matter.
Note we also consider whether repetitions occur or not.
In our case numbers are not repeated.
To calculate the chance of winning we use the formula n!/r!(n-r)!
Using this formula we find that the chances of winning that lottery in any one draw is 1/13,983,816
The number sounds large but I think the first lotto guys were dishonest since some of the American lotteries have even greater odds and guys hit the jackpot almost all the time.
Of course their country has a higher population than ours but eight years is too long for no one to have won.
I think it is a scam.


Thanks...so if the probability is 1/13,983,816....if 2% of the population played each week (i.e. 2%*52 weeks) - would that not mean we'd have at least two jackpot winners every year or so? or at least one winner every three years if we look at the total adult population?

BTW pls overlook my flawed reasoning/method...

I suppose we should get out the torches and pitchforks and chase another scammer out of town?
2012
#5 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 4:01:24 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Renegade wrote:
Strange indeed. However, they might just not have been generating enough business. The entry of the flashier SMS based lotteries e.g. 6969 or was it 6868 stole the thunder from them.


Of course they lost out because nobody ever won the jackpot not even once. So why would anyone want to participate in this one while there are many others where people are winning? This was a hoax and Betting Control has failed in it's duty.

BBI will solve it
:)
seketes
#6 Posted : Monday, April 18, 2011 4:09:56 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 9/17/2010
Posts: 35
Location: nairobi
2012 wrote:
Renegade wrote:
Strange indeed. However, they might just not have been generating enough business. The entry of the flashier SMS based lotteries e.g. 6969 or was it 6868 stole the thunder from them.


Of course they lost out because nobody ever won the jackpot not even once. So why would anyone want to participate in this one while there are many others where people are winning? This was a hoax and Betting Control has failed in it's duty.

my big question is that ,if dont return your coupon after the draw you will be shocked to find that you had all the six Numbers or five of them but what happens in there office that no body has never won ?
Burning Spear
#7 Posted : Tuesday, April 19, 2011 12:23:16 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 1,139
2012 wrote:
Renegade wrote:
Strange indeed. However, they might just not have been generating enough business. The entry of the flashier SMS based lotteries e.g. 6969 or was it 6868 stole the thunder from them.


Of course they lost out because nobody ever won the jackpot not even once. So why would anyone want to participate in this one while there are many others where people are winning? This was a hoax and Betting Control has failed in it's duty.



I wonder when was the betting control act done because it sounds 1920s and inherited by kenyatta govt in 1963 because the betting control unit is so corrupt such that every game in kenya is 101% scam yet no one has been taken to court .
"You're not supposed to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who says it". Malcolm X
Djinn
#8 Posted : Tuesday, April 19, 2011 1:57:58 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/13/2008
Posts: 1,565
@burning spear - I have always suspected as much - even those toto 6/49 balls - why can they never weigh each one in front of a live TV audience? or weigh them in 10s to save time. I keep thinking their system, which scans all coupons, can be able to advise them which ball to make a little heavier so it does not get blown into the funnel.....ditto other "lotteries".

It boils down to one thing - with all the pyramid schemes and get rich quick scams going around...greed is part of the Kenyan way of life....easy money....sorry if some have suffered...but...
tommynyong
#9 Posted : Tuesday, April 19, 2011 3:48:26 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 4/19/2011
Posts: 4
Location: Nairobi
It's all a scam. I actually know someone who won in one of the sms competitions after paying of someone on the inside. What's worse is that it was being conducted by literally the biggest company in kenya. Fill in the blank on that one. He was told he would pay and lo and behold he was called and told he had won. After receiving the gift in the whole glare of the media he contacted the inside person paid off what they had agreed on and the rest is history. He even shared one of the gifts with me.
KenyanLyrics
#10 Posted : Tuesday, April 19, 2011 4:49:02 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/16/2010
Posts: 906
Location: Nairobi
tommynyong sema jina ama utoke hapa
lekutoi
#11 Posted : Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:52:14 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 4/19/2011
Posts: 6
Location: Nairobi
Kenyanlyrics you've come down hard on this guy. Just sharing the info for me is enough to tell me to stay away from these scams cause Kenyans have litteraly brought the concept of 'kujuana' into gambling.
Cut the guy some slack.
Anyway I think the biggest company in Kenya is safaricom. If true they should change the name to safaricon.
jguru
#12 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2011 9:18:30 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
"First Lotto Limited, which was running Toto 6/49 lottery before it closed shop under the weight of debts, was wound-up more than one year ago for its inability to pay Fidelity Commercial Bank Sh3.6 million."

http://www.businessdaily...4/-/p5431f/-/index.html

As someone said before, it was all a SCAM from the word go!
Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
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