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Do you think ongeri smokes something?
nesta
#1 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 10:10:44 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/17/2009
Posts: 121
Location: Nairobi
Could someone kindly tell me what Prof. Ongeri and his foot soldiers at Jogoo house drink (or smoke?) For whatever it is, it should be “mututhod” with immediate effect. From the way they are doing their work, they seem to be completely devoid of vision. 10 years ago, the ministry came up with a “randical surngery” in the education system; they reduced the number of required subjects from 8 to 7 for the KCSE and 7 to 5 for the KCPE. In 2003/2004, they removed technical subjects such as Electricity, Power Mechanics, Metalwork, and so on. After four years, (a period punctuated with taskforces, committees, and denials of “there were no irregularities in the exam,”) the same subjects were brought back with much less pomp that had witnessed their exit. And in true Kenya fashion of dealing with NGO problems rather than the real problems, they decided to stop the ranking of schools saying that this had caused certain schools to adopt “unorthodox means of teaching.” In 2010, they set up a taskforce to look into the reasons why students were not performing well in sciences; or was it to look into the reasons why boys are better than girls? Whatever it was, it sounded like the motion of a primary school debate. This year, the guys have again set up another task force to bring up a report within the next three months. I am sure they will set up a committee to look into the findings of this committee.

Now, instead of improving the education standards in public primary schools, they have chosen to go with the nusu mkate/nusu mkeka mentality, of “real power sharing” between pupils from public and private schools. And the year has just begun. I am just sick and tired of being sick and tired of these guys!Brick wall Brick wall Brick wall Brick wall Brick wall Are you?
On Christ Alone
Njore
#2 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 11:46:48 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/6/2010
Posts: 110
He certainly smokes contaminated air.
Silk
#3 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 6:20:38 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/25/2008
Posts: 144
i am sooooo much in pain i have no words. Reason, one Prof ongeri.
Elder
#4 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 6:32:41 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/7/2010
Posts: 2,148
Location: elderville
If they were smoking something they would surely have handled things better. As any random 'smoker of things' will tell you smoking of things tend to enlighten rather than obscure.
He who can express in words the ardour of his love, has but little love to express. - Petrach, Son. (That men by various ways arrive at the same end. - Montaigne, The Essays of.)
nesta
#5 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 8:24:16 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/17/2009
Posts: 121
Location: Nairobi
Silk wrote:
i am sooooo much in pain i have no words. Reason, one Prof ongeri.


What happened?
On Christ Alone
Euge
#6 Posted : Friday, February 04, 2011 9:25:17 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 8/4/2008
Posts: 2,849
Location: Rupi
I support the fact that they don't rank schools. This was making learning too competitive and academic. Actually kids should not be ranked in class coz this encourages competition among themselves. Each child should be encouraged to do their best or compete against their potential. I like the idea of private vs public while selecting kids for form one. If private schools had 10% of the total candidates, they should get only 10% of the slots in national schools.

Regarding what he smokes, maybe he/his wife cooks using firewood and he inhales the smoke. smile
My Zim dollars.
Lord, thank you!
MaichBlack
#7 Posted : Saturday, February 05, 2011 3:49:36 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/22/2009
Posts: 7,452
Euge wrote:
I support the fact that they don't rank schools. This was making learning too competitive and academic. Actually kids should not be ranked in class coz this encourages competition among themselves. Each child should be encouraged to do their best or compete against their potential.

This is what I call Loser mentality. Japan is one of the most competitive countries when it comes to education. Students actually commit suicide for failure to join universities of their choice (you can Google this!). Look where they (Japan) are. One thing your kid should know is that mediocrity is not acceptable in whatever form - unless there is a medical condition. The mediocrity in most kids is more a result of nurture than nature. Unless a kid is a special needs kid, he/she needs to work their a** off. Nini hii?
Euge wrote:
I like the idea of private vs public while selecting kids for form one. If private schools had 10% of the total candidates, they should get only 10% of the slots in national schools.

A very stupid and unimaginative idea from the ministry. Actually this is pure discrimination. The challenge should be to make sure that public schools perform the same or even better than private schools! What do you need in a primary school? There are no elaborate labs and expensive equipments. Buy more books, reduce the student/teacher ratio, demand certain levels of performance from the teachers, monitor, monitor, monitor! We can't do this as a country? We can even dedicate CDF money to these for say 3 years! Some private schools achieve better results with less qualified/experienced teachers! Why? The proprietor/head teacher will not take any crap from the teachers. You perform or ship out!
Never count on making a good sale. Have the purchase price be so attractive that even a mediocre sale gives good returns.
For Sport
#8 Posted : Saturday, February 05, 2011 4:54:31 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/23/2010
Posts: 1,229
MaichBlack wrote:
Euge wrote:
I support the fact that they don't rank schools. This was making learning too competitive and academic. Actually kids should not be ranked in class coz this encourages competition among themselves. Each child should be encouraged to do their best or compete against their potential.

This is what I call Loser mentality. Japan is one of the most competitive countries when it comes to education. Students actually commit suicide for failure to join universities of their choice (you can Google this!). Look where they (Japan) are. One thing your kid should know is that mediocrity is not acceptable in whatever form - unless there is a medical condition. The mediocrity in most kids is more a result of nurture than nature. Unless a kid is a special needs kid, he/she needs to work their a** off. Nini hii?
Euge wrote:
I like the idea of private vs public while selecting kids for form one. If private schools had 10% of the total candidates, they should get only 10% of the slots in national schools.

A very stupid and unimaginative idea from the ministry. Actually this is pure discrimination. The challenge should be to make sure that public schools perform the same or even better than private schools! What do you need in a primary school? There are no elaborate labs and expensive equipments. Buy more books, reduce the student/teacher ratio, demand certain levels of performance from the teachers, monitor, monitor, monitor! We can't do this as a country? We can even dedicate CDF money to these for say 3 years! Some private schools achieve better results with less qualified/experienced teachers! Why? The proprietor/head teacher will not take any crap from the teachers. You perform or ship out!

Can't say it better than MaichBlack.
@ Euge and those similarly minded:
You forget that these kids are supposed to grow up some day and compete. For opportunities. For jobs. For parking slots. For a place on the queue.
And almost everything in life is defined by competition. Brands compete. Teams compete. Co-workers compete. Businesses compete.
Ati competing with your own potential? Ha. Ha. Face the real world. Appreciate the fact that people sharpen you. You think you’ve done well and you look around and realize someone’s doing whatever it is better. And that motivates you improve your game. That’s called competition. Ongeri is not solving the problem by playing God and deciding which child gets to go where at the end of the school cycle. If our children in public school are not getting educated, then how are we helping ourselves by doing nothing about improving the schools and hoping they will get sorted out later elsewhere?
2 Miles
#9 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 8:59:36 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/26/2010
Posts: 125
The discrimination of Public and Private primary schools when it comes to secondary school selection by the Ministry of Education exhibits
nothing but shallow thinking. What needs to be addressed is the reason why public schools post dismal results. And Maichblack has pointed them very well. In addition, guidance & counselling structures in public schools are very poor,which leads to low student morale. This is unlike in private schools, where students are well mentored. Social amenities in these public schools are in deplorable condition too. So lets address these issues head on. A system where some funny criteria is used to select students to secondary schools instead of merit indicates poor leadership.

Ranking, of students in class and schools nationwide, is important. How do we expect these kids to fit in the global business world if they don't know about competition????????


bkismat
#10 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 9:29:29 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 2,375
MaichBlack wrote:
[quote=Euge]I support the fact that they don't rank schools. This was making learning too competitive and academic. Actually kids should not be ranked in class coz this encourages competition among themselves. Each child should be encouraged to do their best or compete against their potential.

This is what I call Loser mentality. Japan is one of the most competitive countries when it comes to education. Students actually commit suicide for failure to join universities of their choice (you can Google this!). Look where they (Japan) are. One thing your kid should know is that mediocrity is not acceptable in whatever form - unless there is a medical condition. The mediocrity in most kids is more a result of nurture than nature. Unless a kid is a special needs kid, he/she needs to work their a** off. Nini hii?
Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause
Same applies to South Korea and Indian students wishing to join the prestigious Indian Institutes of Technology. In order to develop there has to be serious competition.
It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt...
-Mark Twain
Njore
#11 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 1:28:47 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/6/2010
Posts: 110
Good people. You need to appreciate the fact that the government is working extremely hard to achieve the goal of Education for All (EFA). Today we have 26,666 primary and 6,566 secondary schools. This is no mean achievement compared to five years ago when we had about 4,000 secondary schools. The principle of access and equity is critical. Let us acknowledge the fact that the government is doing a commendable job to address perennial gaps in our education sector. Left unchecked, a child from a poor family will continue to get sidelined and disadvantaged for life. The fact that the government cannot solely afford to provide education opportunities to its citizenry does not warrant private provider to dictate terms. The only fair logic is to apply a formula (using ratios & proportions) to accommodate all our children. When we start comparing our education system with those in Japan and South Korea, we miss the point. These are two different worlds that are totally incompatible.
MaichBlack
#12 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 1:59:07 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/22/2009
Posts: 7,452
Njore wrote:
When we start comparing our education system with those in Japan and South Korea, we miss the point. These are two different worlds that are totally incompatible.

What if we compare it with the Malaysian one? Kenya's economy was ahead of that of Malaysia in the 60s and 70s - Remember?

There is something you are not understanding. The question is how did Japan and South Korea get where they are? Is there anything we can learn from them? And of course one of the things that have put them where they are is Education. Competitive education! China has learnt that very first and they are investing heavily in Education and also partnering with the industry - A company sponsors a university or department - equipment, buildings and personnel - and in return they get tax breaks. And guess what, the education system is competitive as hell. You continue rewarding mediocrity and see how far you will go. This is the real world my brother. Everything you do - new business, product etc. - you had better be better than everyone else if you are to survive! The sooner your kid knows that, the better!
Never count on making a good sale. Have the purchase price be so attractive that even a mediocre sale gives good returns.
Njore
#13 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 3:22:19 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/6/2010
Posts: 110
MaichB, just to correct you, I did not imply that we should not borrow ideas from other educational systems. My point was, we should not be always quick to compare ourselves with others. Our national objectives and priorities are different from those of other nations. You and I know very well how much productive time our country lost during the Nyayo-era (quarter of a century - 24 years). We will take a while to make up. When I look at the knowledge and skills that are needed in the modern world, they were neither taught in schools nor colleges. Therefore if we are to make a serious leap in our education sector, there is a serious need to totally overhaul our curriculum. Be that as it may, I am satisfied with the steps the MOE is taking to make education accessible to a majority of the populace. If you get time, grab a copy of the Sessional Paper No. 5 of January 2005 to understand the plans our government has for our education.
QD
#14 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 4:14:53 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/5/2009
Posts: 597
Just a question this kids from the public schools will they be able to cope with the load they"ll find in the national schools????.

Yes we are trying to solve a problem, seem to me btw haves and have not but there may just be more dropouts than we anticipated due to culture shock.
The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts while the stupid ones are full of confidence
simonkabz
#15 Posted : Monday, February 07, 2011 9:59:49 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
QD are u serious? R u telling us National schøøls hav been the preserve of rich kids fm private schs? U cant b more wrong....Infact I take that as a thinly veiled insult to the poor kids. Its such comments that make Ongeri seem so right!
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
bkismat
#16 Posted : Tuesday, February 08, 2011 8:47:53 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 2,375
QD wrote:
Just a question this kids from the public schools will they be able to cope with the load they"ll find in the national schools????.

Yes we are trying to solve a problem, seem to me btw haves and have not but there may just be more dropouts than we anticipated due to culture shock.

Easily the most stupid statement I have ever seen on wazua.
It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt...
-Mark Twain
QD
#17 Posted : Tuesday, February 08, 2011 9:33:23 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/5/2009
Posts: 597
Easy guys i deed not want to offend anybody thats why i stated Just a question.

SORRY if i offended any of the wazuan tribe. my apologies.
The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts while the stupid ones are full of confidence
Jus Blazin
#18 Posted : Tuesday, February 08, 2011 9:45:30 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2008
Posts: 3,966
@QD, apology accepted. Maybe you can always rephrase your question. Like @simonkabz has pointed out, national schools are not the preserve of students from private schools. Because if students from public schools cannot cope with the load in national schools, how then do they cope with the load in universities and high end colleges? Again, we know there are kids who have been from private schools to national schools and then to private universities because they did not qualify to join public universities...
Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity. ~ Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Jus Blazin
#19 Posted : Tuesday, February 08, 2011 9:47:56 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/23/2008
Posts: 3,966
Njore wrote:
MaichB, just to correct you, I did not imply that we should not borrow ideas from other educational systems. My point was, we should not be always quick to compare ourselves with others. Our national objectives and priorities are different from those of other nations. You and I know very well how much productive time our country lost during the Nyayo-era (quarter of a century - 24 years). We will take a while to make up. When I look at the knowledge and skills that are needed in the modern world, they were neither taught in schools nor colleges. Therefore if we are to make a serious leap in our education sector, there is a serious need to totally overhaul our curriculum. Be that as it may, I am satisfied with the steps the MOE is taking to make education accessible to a majority of the populace. If you get time, grab a copy of the Sessional Paper No. 5 of January 2005 to understand the plans our government has for our education.

I agree with you.
Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity. ~ Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Karema Hiti
#20 Posted : Tuesday, February 08, 2011 3:59:34 PM
Rank: User


Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 53
Njore, this is a good piece. The need to identify our needs and our priorities is critical. I also fully concur with you on the importance of giving credit where it's due -- It is true, the MOE has made a major impact on our education since 2003. I'm meant to understand that GoK finances over 94% of our education with a paltry 6% coming from developing partners wrapped with conditionalities & Wikileaks!
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