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Do brokers use limit price orders for profiteering?
Renegade
#11 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 6:59:16 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/18/2009
Posts: 118
mukiha wrote:
If you trust your broker; move!


Applause This one is funny. Just move to the broker you do NOT trust.

But I am sure that this was a typo,no?
Renegade
#12 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:42:27 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/18/2009
Posts: 118
I have experienced this as well. I do not think it is so much of an ulterior motive. It is mainly due to laziness on the part of the dealers.

Besides you have to remember that brokers work for a commission.

The faster they execute the deals at prices that do do not require them to wait, the sooner they get their pay.

Also this can enable them to match the trades both ways meaning they get a commission from both sides of the table. I would do it if I were in their shoes.
youcan'tstopusnow
#13 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:45:27 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 3/24/2010
Posts: 6,779
Location: Black Africa
PKoli, Chaka is right. If you don't have credit, you get a message from your service provider saying you don't have enough money to use the service. Hata uweke pesa ngapi afterwards, you will never get the message. The service costs 10 bob per alert by the way. If you buy 100 kq shares and another 100 centum shares, that is 2 alerts, therefore 20 bob
GOD BLESS YOUR LIFE
VituVingiSana
#14 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 9:47:57 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,354
Location: Nairobi
Laziness BUT also how large is your order?

Say you place an order to buy KenolKobil at 10/- the broker simply enters the order/bid... It is automated... When there Offers come in at 10/- & there are sufficient shares to 'fill' your order... It is done...

Solution: Bid or Offer [Limit Orders] at what you want. If you want to buy KK at 9/- the bid 9/- not 10/-!
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
guru267
#15 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:01:32 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
On liquid counters I always market orders and nothing ever goes wrong...

Like for example yesterday and today i placed orders for Kenol at market price and picked them up at 9.95 on both days even though there were asks at 10-10.1...

Same thing when i sold KPLC... its closed at 234 on both days when i sold with lows of 231 but my broker got my shares sold at 238 with a market order....

if the broker is experienced then one doesnt need to place limit orders on liquid shares...
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
kyt
#16 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:03:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 11/7/2007
Posts: 2,182
seems like there good brokers and lazy ones i wish i knew the good ones!!
LOVE WHAT YOU DO, DO WHAT YOU LOVE.
Renegade
#17 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:36:55 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/18/2009
Posts: 118
guru267 wrote:
On liquid counters I always market orders and nothing ever goes wrong...

Like for example yesterday and today i placed orders for Kenol at market price and picked them up at 9.95 on both days even though there were asks at 10-10.1...

Same thing when i sold KPLC... its closed at 234 on both days when i sold with lows of 231 but my broker got my shares sold at 238 with a market order....

if the broker is experienced then one doesnt need to place limit orders on liquid shares...


Is this the same broker - Dyer & Blair that you were bashing the other day? Or have you now found yourself a "good" broker?
guru267
#18 Posted : Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:50:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
Renegade wrote:
guru267 wrote:
On liquid counters I always market orders and nothing ever goes wrong...

Like for example yesterday and today i placed orders for Kenol at market price and picked them up at 9.95 on both days even though there were asks at 10-10.1...

Same thing when i sold KPLC... its closed at 234 on both days when i sold with lows of 231 but my broker got my shares sold at 238 with a market order....

if the broker is experienced then one doesnt need to place limit orders on liquid shares...


Is this the same broker - Dyer & Blair that you were bashing the other day? Or have you now found yourself a "good" broker?


NOPE its D&B... they can be very inefficient at times but believe me they know how to get the best prices on the NSE...
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
mozenrat
#19 Posted : Thursday, October 14, 2010 8:56:43 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 5/18/2008
Posts: 796
My 2 cents wrote:
I have also wondered about this.

The below is an extract from wikipedia on the definition of front running...........



My 2 cents.. I think you and Wa_ithaka are describing two different scenarios (both unethical). Wa_ithaka is talking about brokers stealing from their clients by executing client orders at higher prices and only submitting the lower figure. With the CDSC sms alert, this is unlikely.. unless you've seen a variance between your broker statement and the alert.

Front running on the other hand is very likely to be happening and is very difficult to prosecute or prove.. After all if a broker starts buying on his own behalf because he's noticed that a lot of his clients are interested in a stock, there's no way to prove that he's interest in the stock did not arise from the same reasons as his clients or from different one's for that matter. Same thing applies if he dumps stocks because he's seen that his clients are dumping them.
ProverB
#20 Posted : Thursday, October 14, 2010 9:35:55 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 3/12/2010
Posts: 1,199
Location: Eastlander
Wa_ithaka wrote:
With all the broker issues at the NSE, I now do all my orders on a limit price basis. However, I've noticed something uniquely Kenyan in the way the NSE brokers process such orders. For a limit price order, the limit price seems to become the buying or selling price. In almost every other stock market I’ve tried, the broker has always used the limit price as a guide for him to find me the best price.
My strong suspicion is that the NSE brokers take profit from limit price orders. If say I send in a limit selling price of Ksh26 for my 10,000 Equity shares and Equity goes to Ksh26.50, I suspect that the broker sells the shares at Ksh26.50, gives me my receipt at Ksh26 and pockets the difference less commission.


if you were a broker..here..or better still..employed by a broker here..and your salary came in format of commission on how much money u bring the firm, would you act any different? considering all/bulk of firms revenues are commission based..and very thin opportunities for income elsewhere apart from may be trading in your own name.
..Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven...Matt5:16
- 1769 Oxford King James Bible 'Authorized Version
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