wazua Sun, Apr 12, 2026
Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Log In

3 Pages<123>
ASSET SECURITISATION! structured finance in kenya? yes it can!
Evolve
#11 Posted : Wednesday, August 25, 2010 12:54:41 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/25/2007
Posts: 96
@Mpenzi, While the legal framework may be a hindrance, the main challenge is how to make the bond attractive given that the source of revenue will end up being the government for all intents and purposes as the public university relies largely on government subsidies for its existence. My take is that this will be treated as infrastructure bond guaranteed by the government. However, the government is reluctant to guarantee due to HIPC considerations. I have approached other institutions to guarantee but there is no appetite. The investors would like to be assured of their investment and though a university bond is welcome, there are serious reservations harbored by investors.
Bodo
#12 Posted : Wednesday, August 25, 2010 1:48:39 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 3/30/2010
Posts: 15
Location: Nairobi
Guys,
I'm really not into the idea of targeting HELB loans...there is great opportunity in 3 areas:
1. mortgage-backed security
2.university accomodations - which is really on the high demand!
3. car loan purchases.

About the legal framework, well I'm not a lawyer and we'll hv to consult!
Wa_ithaka
#13 Posted : Wednesday, August 25, 2010 3:59:58 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/7/2010
Posts: 1,279
Location: nbi
Mmmhhh.

Interesting academic discussion.

First of all, I won't want to hear anything about CDS9they've caused more advanced economies to grind to a halt).
Securitisation is actually done better without credit ratings as they give you a false sense of security.
In Kenya the most obvious underlying instruments are loans and mortgages.
The Governor of Nyeri - 2017
Bodo
#14 Posted : Thursday, August 26, 2010 3:08:33 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 3/30/2010
Posts: 15
Location: Nairobi
anyone with knowledge of good corporate lawyers with in-depth understanding of structured securities?
goldendelight
#15 Posted : Sunday, September 05, 2010 4:13:18 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 9/5/2010
Posts: 6
Location: Nairobi
@ Emily
I like your thinking but... i also think that what you are describing is backing debt with debt.... and in the end a catastrophe is eminent.

See what I mean on "money as debt" by Paul Grignon http://www.moneyasdebt.net/

A good example is the collapse of the housing mkt in US recently and ensuing troubles. Just because Europe and the US are using it doesnt mean it is fault proof. Im not offering a tweak to your theory that would make it work, that would be presumptious, all im saying is maybe we can also learn from the mistakes made in the West.

my two cents
Scubidu
#16 Posted : Sunday, September 05, 2010 7:56:10 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
@goldendelight. Glad to see you are a new member to wazua. Good contribution. Bodo in post 8 and @Wa in post 13 brought up some interesting points you could comment further on. The legal framework is slow, and we have only 1 licenced credit rating agency (but licenced to rate what?). What else should be in focus? What about the lending standards for student loans, for example? Wouldn't that determine their marketability? As i recall it was the laxity of lending standards and the profit incentive by key government backed buyers of such securities that caused the crisis abroad.

my 2 cents

@goldendelight. on another note. Interesting how you watched 'money as debt', been looking for people who have. Have a read on kenya debt watch and CBK reduces rate, see if anything hits you (see links below).

http://www.wazua.co.ke/f...aspx?g=posts&t=2768
http://www.wazua.com/for...aspx?g=posts&t=6382

@emily. sorry to hi-jack your topic kidogo. you can spank me later.
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
goldendelight
#17 Posted : Monday, September 06, 2010 10:54:46 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 9/5/2010
Posts: 6
Location: Nairobi
@ Emily - yeah pole, we seem to have deviated from your initial trail of thought. Pole, but Im happy to have bumped into like minded people :) Cheers!

@Scubidu - The local banks are known to put most of their attention towards gvt bonds as opposed to risky lending to common mwananchi but this trend i think has reduced over the last few years thanks to CBK. Previously you had to proove to the bank that you can afford to do wthout a loan to actually get one, and now there's a lady who stalks my collegues and I to take up a loan, even if i dont need one at the moment. of course when there is no money available to the common mwananchi, the economy will take a hit, so intervention by CBK is great, and welcome.

I saw your comments on fractional reserve banking. Yeah, the system creatss credit whenever someone takes up a new loan, but this is debt backed by debt, in my opinion there must be an elastic limit. We already knee deep in the mess, but i can't think of an alternative at the moment. The money creation process is flawed, and our taking on things that are practised in the west will be our undoing. So far our monetary system is quite conservative, but i think soon we'll scale up in the game.

What did you think of the documentary film - money as debt? More importantly, how do you think we can escape the trap, as individuals yaani?

Secondly have u seen this, and what are your thoughts on it? http://www.theeastafrica.../-/cghfxcz/-/index.html

Personally i think infrstructure bonds are great, coz the infrastructure will stimulate growth in existing sectors, along with job creation during developments, so in a way even though we're taking on a lot of debt, its self sustaining - at least i hope so.

Ur turn...
Scubidu
#18 Posted : Monday, September 06, 2010 1:07:49 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
Bodo wrote:
Guys,
I'm really not into the idea of targeting HELB loans...there's great opportunity in 3 areas:
1. mortgage-backed security
2.university accomodations - which is really on the high demand!
3. car loan purchases.

About the legal framework, well I'm not a lawyer and we'll hv to consult!


@emily. What do you think bodo's 3 areas? Would HELB loans really be asset backed? They seem similar to normal unsecured personal (salaried) loans. Have you done any research on REITs?

@goldendelight. Please let's take this convo to the Kenya Debt Watch topic. You'll see my reply there.
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
goldendelight
#19 Posted : Monday, September 06, 2010 1:32:02 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 9/5/2010
Posts: 6
Location: Nairobi
Scubidu wrote:
Bodo wrote:
Guys,
I'm really not into the idea of targeting HELB loans...there's great opportunity in 3 areas:
1. mortgage-backed security
2.university accomodations - which is really on the high demand!
3. car loan purchases.

About the legal framework, well I'm not a lawyer and we'll hv to consult!


@emily. What do you think bodo's 3 areas? Would HELB loans really be asset backed? They seem similar to normal unsecured personal (salaried) loans. Have you done any research on REITs?

@goldendelight. Please let's take this convo to the Kenya Debt Watch topic. You'll see my reply there.


@ Scubidu - i've checked, i couldnt trace ur comments at Kenya Debt watch... Im new to Wazua site, hope u dont mind showing a girl around. Can u give a link to it? ama send to goldendelight@mail.com.
Thankssmile
Mpenzi
#20 Posted : Monday, September 06, 2010 1:48:18 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 10/17/2008
Posts: 1,234
Anyone interested in asset-backed securities ought to familiarialise him/herself with the Capital Markets (Asset-Backed Securities) Regulations, 2007

http://www.cma.or.ke/ind...&gid=7&Itemid=30
3 Pages<123>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Copyright © 2026 Wazua.co.ke. All Rights Reserved.